Corps Stories Innovators S1E4 - Marine Collin Congleton PART 1 of 2

Corps Stories Innovators Series 1 Episode 4: Collin Congleton - Part 1 of 2

Combat Marine, Scholar, Juris Doctor, Expert marksman, law enforcement officer. 

YouTube version of this podcast: https://youtu.be/foyfKs7K4Pk

YouTuber version of Part 2 of 2: https://youtu.be/okTnbmJIDJI

Transcript

Congleton Podcast PART 1

Corps Stories Ordinary Marines extraordinary lives. . hey y'all today. We get to know Collin Congleton, who is an extraordinary Marine because he showed great courage as a volunteer casualty replacement, that's tough, that's tough duty. Not only does it require a tremendous amount of Marine Corps skill and chops it's very hard to integrate and he stuck his hand up to be  volunteer from his unit.

 Also he is an, just a gifted marksman. He's not somebody you would want to invite to a marksmanship competition. Don't do it. And lastly, he is an extraordinary scholar. He has barreled through undergraduate, law school, passed the bar on the first take, unreal. So this is a two part podcast because our interview was so wonderful it just lasted a long time. So I split it up to two and the first part we get to know his Marine Corps experience. And it's an extraordinary story. I learned about an incredible episode,  with MAP 7, 3/25 MAP 7 that,  I really need y'all to hear. And then, the second part will be about extraordinarily innovative ideas he has about communities facing policing issues. he has so much knowledge and experience as a police officer. So anyway, hit subscribe, I'll catch you on the backside and, and listen to part two.   

Collin: [00:01:54] hi, how are you? 

Meriwether: [00:01:56] Good. I'm glad to see you 

Collin: [00:01:58] as well. 

  so how I got here, I guess just maybe not as traditional a path as, as you may typically get from a lot of Marines.

 So for me, out of high school, I was actually looking at the Naval Academy, I was very fortunate. I had some, I guess you would say neighbors that lived down the road from me. this, this woman was a, a substitute teacher in my high school and we. Got to be friends. It was, I grew up in a very small town, a little one square mile town called Butler in Northern New Jersey.

And so,  small town, we got to be friends and her husband was a former Marine officer. And, I grew up in a, a. Lower middle class family, college wasn't really an option unless I could provide that for myself. And so they were giving me some guidance, this woman and her husband, and were steering me towards the Marine officer route and the Naval Academy.

Helped me to get into, the summer seminar down there. And I, I did all of that. And, my senior year. While in the application process, I also applied for a Marine option Naval ROTC scholarship.  with that you apply to college on your own it's it's on you to get accepted to a college that it offers the program and, I went down to visit university of South Carolina in Columbia.

And, I, I just fell in love with the place and I was very fortunate to get accepted there. And that was, I listed that as my number one choice for the Marine officer scholarship, which I also got, I believe it was one of 17 awarded in the state of New Jersey. 

Meriwether: [00:04:01] absolutely love it. 

Collin: [00:04:02] I was, I was very, very fortunate.

 I went down there and. Long story that I don't know. I think we have time to get into here, but it didn't work out. I was able to do, a DOR, because of an injury that I sustained. And, I was also having, academic issues. I was having a lot of family issues that year, just a lot of stuff going on and, So I went back home to Jersey and the Marine Corps remained something that I, desperately wanted to do.

I ended up becoming a cop. I got hired by the Morris County Sheriff's office when I was 20 years old. And, I make it through my probationary period and I'm finding that I'm just not really. Thrilled with the job. And at the time, this is now 2003, 2004 timeframe. So we're well into Afghanistan and now into Iraq as well.

And, A local Marine officer, a guy by the name of, JT blue was killed in Iraq. And at the same time, Pat Tillman was killed. And those things just really, I recall that they really weighed on me and. The way that the law enforcement perfection works in New Jersey, with civil service, it was.

I won't say unheard of, but I couldn't find anybody at the time who went into the military after being on the job. But what I found was is that job would be protected based on the law was for the gardeners. Right. And so I looked at particularly a Pat Tillman story, and I said to myself,  here's a young man.

Who left a multimillion dollar NFL contract and went and did what he did. I have a, of a far less significant job, that will be here when I get back. If I, if I get back, how can I not do this? And, and I knew that. I would regret it for the rest of my life if I didn't give it a shot. And so, on my lunch break, one day I walked into a recruiting office and I enlisted in the Marine Corps in the reserves so that I could keep that job.

So I went and, I went to Paris Island. I was with a third crew training, battalion platoon, 3002 from October of Oh four till early January of, five. Right after bootcamp went to infantry school, I was contracted as a machine gunner. Oh three 31 went to a SOI from January through March of 2005.

And then I checked into golf company. Second battalion, 25th Marines in, March of 2005 as fate would have it.  and this is how you and I came to know each other. I think,  I, I checked into my unit and that very first, drill. The company gunny a very well known guy in this area and in New Jersey and New York, a guy by the name of gunnery Sergeant Mario Monaco,  gets out in front of the company and explains to us that a third battalion fifth Marines is downrange in Iraq at the time.

And they're losing a lot of guys. And they're asking for volunteers to come over as combat casually with your replacements. And,  it was just one of those moments in life that you.

I guess some guys would call it like a, like a coming to God moment.  like here I am,  I just graduated infantry school. I'm just checking into a unit and here was an opportunity to go do really what I, what I signed up for,  I knew I signed up. While things were at their, at their height, essentially in Iraq and Afghanistan.

How could I, not at this moment, raise my hand if I would have been ashamed if I did. And, so I did. And, I went. With my thought, I want to say it was about 65 guys, maybe roughly, that all came together down at camp Lazoon. Some were in voluntarily recalled, from the IRR, most were volunteers. I think out of the 65 that showed up down there for like a six week rapid deployment, training.

Evolution, I think maybe 40, some odd ended up going over. And, and so we went and joined three 25, when we got on deck over there. Most of the guys were assigned to, security positions and they took the handful of us that were weapons MOS. So machine gunners, motorman, assortment, and so on, and assigned us to a weapons company.

And so we were put into what was called at the time, map teams, mobile assault, platoon teams, and. Again, as fate would have it. I was assigned to K bar seven, which was with a bunch of phenomenal guys, including some of the guys that you've interviewed, corporate Corbyn corporate Shuler. Now I believe captain Shuler, just some, some incredible men.

those two are in the Navy cross and a silver star for action.  just a couple of weeks before I got there. And, 

Meriwether: [00:09:56] when did you, when did you arrive in here? 

Collin: [00:09:59] I got over there in July of 2005. So the incident at  dam had happened just prior 

Meriwether: [00:10:09] to hospital? 

Collin: [00:10:10] Yeah, I 

Meriwether: [00:10:10] had the, the hospital was may, so it was just, I kind of have to stop and interrupt you here because, for those who are listening and now watching, it's very, I'm trying so hard to hold back.

Tears here. I'm ruining my makeup because it's a, it's an extraordinarily tragic season for the Marine Corps. This was the, you were assigned to the. unit that had the most casualties in the entire war. Yeah. And you were assigned there after a series of horrific events. It wasn't, it wasn't just me. It was in March, may, June.

So there were a number of. That battalion just had no, no relief. I think in the end they lost 48... 

Collin: [00:11:00] 48 Marines and sailors killed in action. And probably,  and this is an estimate, I think it was over a hundred, purple hearts in addition to those that were Kia. 

Meriwether: [00:11:13] Yeah. And so,  just. To give the listeners some background there just between regarding Collin and I, so I didn't know anything because it was ...the battalion..., as you say, kind of grew and shrunk and grew and shrunk.

There are people in and out that I, and to tell you the truth, That came our seven event at the  hospital just was like the deep black hole of my writing career. It was so intense research and writing, but, that event, as you say, there was a Navy cross for, Todd Corban and a silver star for Jeff Schuller.

and they both remained. So they were there when you got there, even though either one of them. Could have, they were both, I think they both received purple hearts, but they, either one of them could have said, I'm done,  I'm outta here. And they didn't, they stayed. And so when I met you and I talked to Jeff Schuler about you, who never says anything nice about anybody.

He said, Oh, Collin. Like the best marksman  I'm like, what did you actually say? And he said, yeah, he was, he was given the 50 caliber right. Upon arrival, which is just like, I'm like, Oh my golly, I'm in the presence of loyalty here. So how, so the fact that you made that impression with these extraordinarily seasoned.

Marines, combat Marines, especially, and that their legacy was then there. So, yeah, that just, the listeners really needed to know that about you. And I knew you wouldn't put it in, so I had to put it in. 

 Collin: [00:12:52] yeah. again, one of those. Things that you look back and, and it was clearly just a fate kind of thing.

 I arrive in theater. I get assigned to that team, which was a, a tremendous stroke of luck. I mean, some of the most phenomenal Marines you could ever hope to serve with,  Todd Corbin was like myself, a Sheriff's deputy. And, 

Meriwether: [00:13:17] and remains now he's sheriff, 

Collin: [00:13:19] right? And, Shuler, this, this all American,  wrestler from Ohio state and, all the guys in the team were just phenomenal.

There, there were, Incredible. There was an incredible writer. There were family men. There were just all these, this incredible compilation of young men that, I just had,  tremendous impact on me. And I get there and within, I think it was the first week that I was there. we, that team was assigned as the PSD, when that was required.

The personal security detail for the battalion commander, Sergeant major, any incoming, VIP and, One day, very early on the sort of major needed to go to a fog out in a hit in the city of hit. We were operating out of campaign. And, this guy, Randy Idiaquez is who was a, a young junior Marine, Lance corporal,  and, and this.

I struggled with this for a long time. But Iddy, as we called him, took my seat in, in the truck. He, and he bumped me back to a seven ton. The way the math teams were set up was you had a three Humvees and a seven ton. And, He took what was my seat in this Humvee to sit with the Sergeant major.

And, that truck ended up getting hit by a suicide bomber. They, van Laden with explosives driven by what we estimated to be about a 12 year old boy. And, Iddy was, was wounded in that incident.  And at the time,  being an outsider and a, in a boot PFC, I got promoted to Lance corporal, later in August.

So I was as, as boot as boot could be. And, Iddy, Iddy quickly befriended me just being the kind of man that he is, Where all these guys were so tight after being through so many horrific things together already, I was definitely an outsider. And while my heart was in the right place, in,  in joining them, I hadn't earned my place among them yet.

And Iddy, with no regard for that just wanted to. Treat me good,  And, 

Meriwether: [00:15:48] I love it. Yeah. I didn't know that. I didn't know that story. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. 

Collin: [00:15:53] So, in that incident, the Moraine that, that had been one of the turret gunners, a guy by the name, and this is going back now 15 years. And I haven't seen him since, so forgive me if I get this wrong, but I believe his name was Jay Michael Bond.

He was injured in that incident, had his, your drums blown out and, some other injuries. So I went to the platoon Sergeant and I said,  I'm a school train machine gunner. I know the 50 very well. I know. All of the weapons systems, the two 40, the Mark 19, if you're going to have to shuffle some guys around or,  if you just need made it to step into that role, I would be happy to do it.

And, that's what ended up happening. so I, I took over the position as the 50 Cal turret gunner on the number two truck and the team. And I remained there for the rest of that deployment. And, yeah. We, we went through,  the, the team had been through quite a bit prior to my arrival. and we went through quite a bit in the time, in the brief time that I was there from about July through October.

I think we, we left, September 30th. We got back to LeJeune I think right, right on the 1st of October,  And by that time, it was, as you touched on, it was 48 Kia from that battalion, which was,  a huge, huge number. 

Meriwether: [00:17:21] Well, there was, it was, it was huge. And it was, as I say, the worst in the, for any unit, but it was these massive losses at one time.

In one event like 

Collin: [00:17:35] yeah, six man sniper team killed in one event. I believe it was, 14 killed at another event where a, a, AAV went over a double stack and anti-tank mine there, there were numerous incidents like that.  The majority of those killed during that deployment were from IEDs, which was very, very frustrating because

as Marines,  we are more than happy to engage in combat. That's our reason. For existence, that's our purpose,  and, and,  to engage in a firefight is, is one thing. And I think something that most Marines would say they're welcome,  but to get hit with an IED and then. I have no, no way of hitting back was incredibly frustrating.

so that, that was, that was difficult. But,  so that was my first deployment. I, I came back to 2/25, checked in to a weapons, platoon, a golf company back there as a machine gunner. I was there until.  summer of 2007, when I, went through the application process for the battalions, sniper platoon, scout sniper platoon, and I was accepted to that and, transferred up to H and S company at Garden City Long Island, and, stepped into to the sniper platoon.

I stayed there until I got out in 2012. We deployed in 2008, 2009, by which time I was a corporal and eventually promoted to Sergeant, served in a variety of roles there as a training NCO, And, and ultimately when I got out, I was a scout sniper team leader. and for any of the guys, from the sniper community that might hear this, I have to say this.

I was a proud pig. I was not a hog. 

Meriwether: [00:19:34] you're going to have to break that down. Unpack that for me. 

Collin: [00:19:36] So in the, in the sniper community kinda like,  and the rest of the Marine Corps, you have, grunts and pogues and that,  that, sometimes, sometimes is an important distinction. Yeah. In the, in the scout sniper community, in the Marine Corps, you have pigs and hogs.

A pig is a professionally instructed gunman. A hog is a hunter of gunman earn the coveted title of hog. You have to graduate from the Marine Corps scout sniper school and earn your hogs tooth. And, the school seats are tough to come by, particularly in the reserves. And, I had at one point a school seat, I had I got injured and, wasn't able to go to, to the schoolhouse when we came back from deployment.

We went to the bottom of the list for school seats. And I ended up getting out before I ever got to go to school. for school seats. And I ended up getting out before I ever got to go to school. I was very, very fortunate in that the senior Marines in the platoon, all of whom were, were school, train snipers, all of whom are hogs. one in particular, Jason Delgado. Who's got a great book out.

He was actually a sniper instructor for MARSOC in their early days. And, He was one of the guys who put a lot of time into training me and put me into that position of sniper team leader. everything in that community is based on merit. And so it's something I'm very proud to be able to stay that I was able to, to serve in that role.

But it's important, as I said, for anybody from that community who might be listening, to. To make that known,  cause it is an important distinction. So I see 

Meriwether: [00:21:17] it. I see your four legged friend behind you and he's got he scouting something back there. 

Collin: [00:21:22] Yeah. Yeah. That's Astra. She's a puppy still  yeah. Got her in, January. So she's. She's only about six months old. So yeah, she's, she's a, she was a rescue. She's a pit-mix, but she looks very much. Well, like a black lab. 

Meriwether: [00:21:40] Yeah. Yes. She's got that snout so I can see her hunting. She says she's a hunter. Yeah. I love it. Okay. So, okay. So we have this image of you as this,  Sheriff's deputy.

Marine sniper extraordinairre is how you, how you're known in the, Oh, its true stop it. Listen, if he, if, or said it, come on now,  how that goes? So he's for listeners, Jeff Schuller, . He's not perfect, but he is an icon. he, he has done,  an awful lot.

A lot of different roles in the Marine Corps, but also.  here's a really bulletproof that day that he was and the turret. Yeah. 

Collin: [00:22:23] I am anybody who listens to this to go look at his story. It is amazing. And 

Meriwether: [00:22:31] It's really, it's miraculous. 

Collin: [00:22:33] It really is. And  you say he's not perfect, but as Marines go, he is, he is as close to a role model.

And, and as you said, an icon, he's an icon, as, as any Marine you'll find, I mean, he's just amazing. And  it's fear. What he, apparently said to you is, is quite humbling. And, it was one of the greatest privileges of my life to be able to serve next to him and  the rest of the men in 

that team.

Yeah. So it's, you're thinking of Mayer. We were talking about 

Mayer. 

Mayor is the writer, I believe you were talking about. another one of the, Haditha hospital ambush, heroes, total. I mean, it's, it was just a. And you read about it as I have. I did the most research on that event of any Marine Corps writer, but 

I agree with this, it's a damn shame that he wasn't recognized more appropriately for what he did that day.

I think that is. His Valor award, should have been higher, that could be said for all of them. And I, and I think anybody who, who looks at the, Navy Cross citation for Todd Corbin would look at that and say, let's say a 

Meriwether: [00:23:47] Medal of Honor. 

Collin: [00:23:47] Right? 

Meriwether: [00:23:48] And also for Kalinowski, I think that we all signed on to, an upgrade for Kal, because he was the one with his dominant hand, completely destroyed in that event.

Feeding ammo to Schuller who held off the enemy long enough for Corbin's collect everybody and get that seven on the rolling 

Collin: [00:24:08] out of there. Yeah. 

Meriwether: [00:24:09] It's an amazing story. But basically the story is that they were called out to the hospital because the hospital was under attack and then they were trapped by the insurgent's and, this suicide, van, as you were describing happening so many times was what  what took out the end, but in the end, in the end, so, and then forwarded 16, purple hearts and Navy Cross, Silver Star and three or four Bronze Stars.

I can't remember how many, so, yeah, it is a huge compliment from, from Schuller. Stan Mayer definitely deserved an upgrade, so did Kalinowski, and probably probably a number of others, but in the end, I can see why you were so proud to be with that unit. Even though from my perspective, I didn't know you, then I would have been shaking in my boots the entire time after you arrived.

And before you all shipped home, because it was a, just such a, they had such a target on their back. 

Collin: [00:25:11] Yeah. well, yeah,  in, in the, if you step back and look at the big picture and,  in the big scheme of things, I'm so grateful for that time, it was without a doubt. The worst and most difficult time of my life.

But also the best. And I think many Marines who served in combat will quickly understand this. It, it gave me perspective,  for, for so many other situations in my life. And it prepared me for other things, The difficult things that you go through, are are usually I think the most important and I mean, man, that was, that was a that was a hell of a time.

And we've, we went through a lot together. but we, we survived it and  that just I'm, I'm so grateful for that. And I'm so grateful for the example that those men set for me when I was a young man at a time in my life where I was, Trying to figure it out. 

Meriwether: [00:26:20] No. Now, so, but not a lot of you have really had a different path, an unusual path since then.

Collin: [00:26:28] Yeah. Yeah. 

Meriwether: [00:26:29] That's what intrigued me for this podcast is that.  so many Marines have served and served with such valor like you and, and the people you're, but it's not that frequent when the education subsequent to combat becomes so precious to you. So talk about that, that journey to here. 

 Collin: [00:26:52] So we get back in 05, late in 05.

And at the time I was working for the Morris County Sheriff's office in New Jersey, which is a kind of a suburban and in some parts rural area, for a number of reasons. I'll just say I was not satisfied with where I was at. So, I looked to make a move and I ended up going out to Jersey City, to the police department there.

And, Jersey City is, it was a tough town, so, much better fit for me. And, that it was at the same time that I ended up going over to platoon, both happened in the summer of 07.  So I ended up getting out of the Marine Corps in 2012 and I had some GI bill benefits and,   I had that one year of college under my belt that I didn't finish.

And that for me was something on my, on my bucket list. If you will, it was something I felt compelled to finish. And so, and obviously I didn't want my GI bill benefits to go to waste. So, I enrolled in classes, in two, I guess it was 2012. I was 30.  At the time I was going on just about 10 years on the job as a cop,  went to New Jersey City university in Jersey City.

 excuse me, one second. I'm just kidding.

 Yeah, so I, went to NJCU, pursued a bachelor's of science in national security studies. I graduated,  in 2015. And so that was, it was about two and a half years it took me to bang out my bachelor's, work, working full 

time. 

I was working full time at the time I was in our street crimes unit in the violent crime squad in Jersey city.

So we were a we're getting after it. And, I was, going to school full time.  but  again, I said before that the perspective that I gained from that deployment in 2005,  and, and from. My experience in the Marine Corps overall. My idea of what's what difficult is, or what work is, is, is perhaps different than your average person,  it altered that.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's all relative, but,  having, having been a grunt and a combat vet, going to school wasn't that hard, so I finished up there and, I still had, about a year and a half of GI bill benefits remaining.  And I, and I wanted, I found that I liked school.

I liked learning. I felt that it made me a better, it made me better as a cop and better as a human. And,  I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do, but I felt very strongly, I saw up close some of the, the losses experienced by 3/25 and in a number of incidents, like the one with, there was this sense that, that very easily could have been me and perhaps should have been. And so I felt a deep obligation to make the most of the gift that was given to me.

Meriwether: [00:30:27] Take your time. 

Collin: [00:30:29] By those Marines who didn't come home,  to earn that and, to not squander it,   and, and that's been a powerful motivator for me to just do everything I can to get the most out of the life that they gave to me, and to honor them and to honor the sacrifices that they've made.

And so,  pursuing my education, I saw as just one of, one of those things, So when I finished undergrad, 

I was looking at master's programs and a very good friend of mine, a guy that I'm still real close with today, by the name of Ari Moss, he's a, he's currently a captain in the NYPD. we were police academy classmates. He went through the Academy with me in New Jersey and went to work for West orange PD and then later left and went to NYP PD.

But he had just finished law school and he said,  you should, you should really apply to law. And, I said, you're out of your mind. There's no way I would get up to the law school. I'm just,  I'm just some grunt,  I, I, I couldn't even fathom such a thing. And, Ari is is a brilliant guy and, knew exactly how to motivate a Marine.

He goes, yeah, you're right. You probably couldn't get in.

 Hey, y'all do we love Colin so far? I mean, he's just kind of the first half, second half, maybe even better. Anyway. Check it out. Subscribe. And, I'll catch you in the next one.   Corps Stories Ordinary Marines. Extraordinary lives. .